Looking For A Few More Horses...

[cammson 0]

Hi there, im pretty new to the site so bear with me here...

 

At the moment im just about finished building a fast road/track 205 1.9 Gti.

It has a few modifications to give it a bit more ooomf, but would like more

 

Things done so far. . . .

 

4 Branch Manifold

Straight Through Exhaust

Kn'N Filter

Quaife Paddle Clutch

Quick Shift

Silicone Hoses as far as the eye can see!

 

Was just looking for some info on what else i could do to give it more power?

i want to keep the 1.9 engine and not really wanting to go down the turbo'd road...

 

Any info atal would be greatly appreciated...

 

Cheers People...

Edited January 5, 2010 by cammson

[Baz 421]

Camshaft, Mappable Management, headwork, more throttle butterflies...

 

The list is endless!

[cammson 0]

Camshaft, Mappable Management, headwork, more throttle butterflies...

 

The list is endless!

 

 

Been told the engine has an uprated cam in already but have no proof...

 

mappable management sounds a good route for the now...

 

any suggestions as to what i should go for??

 

cheers.

[Baz 421]

Emerald?! I may be biased! There's loads to choose from though...

 

Should be easy to tell if it has an uprated camshaft fitted, it may well be fairly lumpy at idle, or you can check physically by whipping off the cam cover as there's usually something on the cam itself, or on the end of it under the dizzy there'll be some stamped info on it.

[DrSarty 90 1 Cars]

Have you tried looking through some of the 8v (1.6 & 1.9) project threads on here?

 

As Baz says, the list is endless, but the modifications are more or less the same for any engine. It's not as if there's some secret formula for something easy you haven't done which is suddenly going to unleash another 10bhp+, which you'll actually notice on the road/track.

 

The improvements become not only more subtle, but more expensive too.

 

I also agree with Baz that a proper mappable ECU is THE best place to start. Emerald, DTA, Omex or KMS (but not Megasquirt IMO) with you already planning who's going to map it in advance by consulting with the mapper and making the right purchase that suits you both. You need to aim off for a spend of £900-£1000.

 

On a side note, whilst I love 8v engines, if your craving for more power starts getting the better of you then you seriously need to start looking at a 16v platform to work with, as gains with the 8v will now start costing progressively more for less results, whereas the 16v engine has loads more 'headroom' for you to develop.

 

I fully appreciate that if you're in a specific motorsport class that demands 8v, then the last comment is irrelevant, other than meaning it's time to accept that your power gains will pretty much match how deep your pockets are.

Edited January 5, 2010 by DrSarty

[harryskid 193]

Also add on some webbers.

[Baz 421]

Also add on some webbers.

 

Said that...

 

Camshaft, Mappable Management, headwork, more throttle butterflies...

 

The list is endless!

[edbar 6]

Agree with sarty that 16v is the only cost effective route for big power, I will be doing this possibly next year.

But check out my trackday 309 gti thread ( True underdog story) I have a tuned 1.9 8v and some of the ideas might be of help to you.

For the money i have spent on my 8v though i could have had probably 220bhp 16v! Mine is at max 170 ish!

[mr_exe 1]

Put the car on a diet?

[cammson 0]

cheers for all the comments guys...

 

Edbar, i had a look at your 309 thread, its given me a few ideas...might not go to the same extent you have but something all those lines is what am looking for, cheers...

 

mr exe, iv already put the car on a diet...

 

im goin to make a project thread just shortly so you can all see how it looks so far...

 

cheers, stuart

[ravydavy 0]

Don't kid yourself on how much you will spend. Times it by four then double it and triple it. One thing i will say is keep your engine options open. Their are a lot of more reliable more powerful engines out their. I spent a fortune on my mi16 to not even get close to a standard honda k20 engine. plus the reliability issues they have on track.

[CaptainK 11]

I spent a fortune on my mi16 to not even get close to a standard honda k20 engine. plus the reliability issues they have on track.

+1. I spent a fortune on my GTi6 + ITB + management setup. Its a great setup, but it would have probably been a lot cheaper to chuck in something like a Honda unit or a Clio 197 engine etc.

[adam2oh5 0]

get the piper hot hatch cam.its been tested to be better with the std plenum chamber so no need for webbers.and being almost a 300 deg cam its quite impressive performance.bit dificult to drive through town but just keep it revving carnt beat the sound of a really lumpy cam once set up right on tick over!

[Dogboy 1]

I was really close to fitting a GTi6 lump into my 205, had the engine in my garage and everything, but decided at the last minute not to, and sold it on.

Subsequently i am now spending a few bob on the 1.9 engine, but i do really enjoy how differently it drives being an 8valve and not 16valve. That is kind of one reason why im opting for abit more fine tweaking from the 1.9 instead of the conversion. Carbs (sound lovely as well) with cam work well if you cant afford the TB's/mappable management system imo.

[opticaltrigger 52]

Yep,I've got to go with ravydavy & CapitanK also here on this one.I'm also going on with a 1.9 8v project at the moment but only because I have somthing specific in mind.If it's just power for powers sake that your after and there's nothing wrong with that,then you do really have to bear in mind the fact that fitting a more modern power plant not only brings the benefit of out the box power but it also comes with super reliability and stagering fuel economy to boot.

Also another thing to way up is the fact that even if you paid a proffesional company to do a top quality instalation at top prices,your overall costs would still be lower than that which can be spent on performance upgrades in the tuning world.

I guess it depends alot on how you veiw the car.If your a purist and want to keep the original motor and fancy a technical challenge then the tuning road is the way to go.But if you simply want to go as quickly as possible and the originality of things is not an issue for you then take a look at some facts and figures on alternative power plants.

 

One other thing to be considered on a purely power verses cost basiss is the thought of using nitrous oxide injection.

Now at thiss point I know Im on thin ice with thiss subject (and I might get shot down in flames here) but it canot be denied that in terms of power for cost there isnt much else that can touch it.

The problem for poor old nitrous is that it gets a bad rep allways and is shrouded in myth and legened.These myths were born in the early seventies and concreted into place forever in the last decade by movies like The Fast & The Furious.

The truth is that in the early days of nitrous some very clever,dedicated and talented engineers started working with it and in the course of there development work they blew the crap out of just about everyting they bolted it on to,but it was exactly that "development work" and they did develop it,to a stageringly high degree of efficiency.

And now,in the last twenty years or so with the advent of microcontrollers,softly softly boxes and the complete understanding of fuel to oxygen ratios in any enviroment of combustion,it can safley be said that nitrous has reached it's zenith and can be bolted to any motor with as much or more confidence as any other tuning route.The only problem is you need to keep filling up the bottle and you must understand the mechanical limitations of your chosen power plant,but it certainly should be given a fair hearing.

 

All tuning is a compromise of benefits.It's just a question of where would you like to place your compromises,but most importantly just have fun doing it.

 

All the very best

O.T.

[baz205gti 0 1 Cars]

Isn't everyone looking for more horses

[GLPoomobile 958]

I'm just looking for a car that works and someone to love me

 

[welshpug 1,661]

Sarty isn't looking for Power, he's looking for torques

[GLPoomobile 958]

Sarty isn't looking for Power, he's looking for torques

 

Or to put it another way, horses for courses

[DrSarty 90 1 Cars]

I'll love you Steve*.

 

Also, looking for more power and torque are more-or-less the same thing. They are intrinsically linked; but let's not go there yet again.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

*As soon as you stop being a c*nt.