Gti6 Pros And Cons Against Mi16 Pros And Cons

[James_R 3]

You mean didn't like being aircooled???

[Veero 1]

Mine had a full rebuild before it went into my 205. No knackered and worn big end shells in there. It's had oil and filter every 3000 miles and it was run in well etc so no reason to suggest why there should be any problems.

 

Fashion statement or not if the oil pressure drops like lead weight that can't be a good thing in any way. I don't really want to be stuck at the side of anywhere with a spun big end bearing just because you're sceptical about "forum fashion". It can hammer around roundabouts all day long and the pressure stays up. Even thinking about a long sharp left hander and it's already dropping regardless of revs. Frankly I'd rather not have to deal with all the bollocks of repairing it all.

[James_R 3]

Just chuck the extended baffled sump set up on if it's a bad one then? why get rid of a full rebuilt engine you know the history of for a high mileage Gti-6? Be cheaper to get some custom ground solid profile cams and put an oil restrictor in, job done?

[Batfink 201]

It would be easy to tap an extra drain into the head? I've seen it done before....

 

Kev

[engine killer 6]

Do not know whether it is design fault or not, my friend's team running 307 with EW10 engine suffers oil surge too when it corners above 7,500rpm even with baffle from Peugeot Sport. It also show sign of slight surge on dyno too around 8,000rpm. Their finding was the oil drainage cannot cope with high volume of oil around the head at high rev. At last they use accusump and problem cured.

 

IIRC a few years back there was someone here saying having two extra drainage pipes connected to the head to allow extra drainage to the sump. Has anyone got any update or can this actually be done?

 

By the way, a few years back my blueprinted Mi with around 10,000 mile on the clock suffered a surge during a trackday event, oh, long fast 3rd gear left hander as well.

[Galifrey 1]

It would be easy to tap an extra drain into the head? I've seen it done before....

 

Kev

 

Was about to post this, a lot of cossie engines have this

[brumster 135 1 Cars]

Question (just curious). Why would it happen on left handers? Common sense would have told me that during a left-hander the oil in the sump surges to the right, which is the side the pickup is on, so maybe I don't have an understanding of why surge occurs.... I thought it was the pickup being starved in the sump? Are there other ways it can happen too? Presumably it's, in the cases mentioned above on left handers, oil in the head swishing over to the right and not being able to drain down to the bottom quick enough?

[James_m 0]

I agree with Veero, wish it was just a fashion! and i run the full sump setup from an S16 which for those unfamiliar is the higher pressure oil pump spring, faster geared sprocket and trap door sump with petert extended pick up.

It would seem some suffer more than others, CW's track car for example seems to have lastest well enough and i seem to remember reading its on original bearings!

Would love to know why though.

[engine killer 6]

Question (just curious). Why would it happen on left handers? Common sense would have told me that during a left-hander the oil in the sump surges to the right, which is the side the pickup is on, so maybe I don't have an understanding of why surge occurs.... I thought it was the pickup being starved in the sump? Are there other ways it can happen too? Presumably it's, in the cases mentioned above on left handers, oil in the head swishing over to the right and not being able to drain down to the bottom quick enough?

 

I guess the reason it happens to left hander more than right is mainly due to most people corner left hander better than right. Will the drains on the right worse than left? Perhaps I guess.

 

During my last engine rebuild, sump baffled/trap door and GTi-6 pump used but forgot the petert's pump extension. May get it when I get chance to trackday shortly.

[Batfink 201]

Question (just curious). Why would it happen on left handers? Common sense would have told me that during a left-hander the oil in the sump surges to the right, which is the side the pickup is on, so maybe I don't have an understanding of why surge occurs.... I thought it was the pickup being starved in the sump? Are there other ways it can happen too? Presumably it's, in the cases mentioned above on left handers, oil in the head swishing over to the right and not being able to drain down to the bottom quick enough?

 

It the drain back down into the sump and the heads capacity to hold a lot of oil thats the problem rather than the sump itself so more efficient drainage could solve the problem.

This is somewhat backed up by solid lifter converted race mi16 engines as they have a restrictor to the head as they do not need as much oil, Sandy said once that this works - though is quite expensive if you are not competing!

 

I'd be interested in comparing the head design of the later gti-6 and why the head does not hold so much oil.

 

Kev

Edited October 5, 2009 by Batfink

[welshpug 1,661]

it has two separate cam carriers rather than one large one.

[Batfink 201]

so all you need is about £50 of metal putty

[James_R 3]

As said more a question of the return over the flywheel side of the block, but you can get accumlation related loss of oil pressure on right handers (A14/M11) crossover for example. os more sorting the return out than the head filling, bit like putting a smaller bath on the same drain with the tap filling it, so it's sort of address the issue in the wrong place. But yet to be seen Cam's running his XU9/RS engine and not seen surge, but not been on any track which may cause it.

 

There's also the piston located rods thing over the 8v's using the crank located rods which Nick is trying but not heard feedback for a while about that route.

[Veero 1]

Yeah I can see the obvious advantages with sticking with the Mi, I know history, how this one is etc etc. After another fruitless night of farting around with it turns out I've had the dizzy spacer plate on the wrong way round for 4 years but it's only running on 2/3 and 2 of the dizzy pins don't give out a spark, so new cap, leads, coil (old one died on tuesday probably trying desperately to spark across a duff cap) and leads are on order, if anyone knows where I can get a new dizzy spacer from that would be great. Mine fell into about 15 bits trying to get it off.

 

Anyways, as it happens James I already have the 1.9 8v crank, pistons and an XU10 sump with baffle and oil pick up with the baffles on, so I guess I could get this ignition sorted and then try the above parts, if that doesn't solve the pressure dropping then maybe call it a day but after speaking to Doug tonight, I have come round to the idea that I'm sure I will love it again when it works right. Hopefully my loom is now solid, (worked fine for a few days anyways before coil went) so all the other niggles can be sorted relatively easily. Since I'm without a second car (pending finding a nice Legacy) then I'm in no position to start another conversion anyway. Perhaps I will just stick with this damn Mi for now then. Maybe a PeterT inlet cam and raise the rev limit would rekindle my enthusiasm for it too, that would probably all go quite well with an engine out and fitting the sump and other gubbins...