205 Gti6 Installation

[Gman 29]

I'm sure this has been asked a thousand times by clueless muppets like myself, however, after an hour of searching I am struggling to get a decent amount of information.

 

Is there a definative guide on how to install the 6 engine into a 205 and could someone point me in the right direction. Cheers!!

 

Graham

[pugpete1108 62 1 Cars]

not really sure if there is a 'guide' as such but the six engine is pretty much the same and any other xu engine in that it mounts the same.

there are a few problems that come with a bigger engine (brake servo/exhaust manifold clearance etc.)

what exactly do you need to know?, i'll help as much as i can and i'm sure the other 6 guys on here will too.

[SurGie 54]

There are loads of project threads converting a 205 gti to a gti 6 engine, however most of them do seem to be long winded and

not all have the full complete info needed in simple stages. Everyone's thread's are different.IMO

 

Would be nice to have a FAQ on MI16/GTI6 engine conversions though.

 

Best way is just do a lot of reading and homework from this forum, then start your conversion thread with your limited newly

found knowledge and members will help you along the way.

[Flix 0]

It is a relatively straight forward job.

Only issues really are master cylinder and exhaust manifold clearance. Thers a few ways to get round these issues.

Even the wiring is quite easy.

Loads of threads to search through, it's all here.

[gti-si 0]

There's more than enough info to complete the conversion on here. You've just got to set some time aside for some research onthe subject. Best places to check are the Members Work's. There isn't a specific guide because there's different methods of doing the conversion, everyone does it how they prefer. Example is the Ex Mani clearance, some people cut and weld, some people extend the lower fork andtilt the engine slightly, it's all discussed.

 

Wiring, you may find a little overcomplicated on the few threads, a lot of wire numbers darted about here there and everywhere but it really is quite simple. Best thing to do is get yourself a project thread up, then when you hit a problem you can't solve, ask about it. There's plenty people who will be eager to help

 

And Re: Mi16 installation guide, check the main site

[Gman 29]

My main worries, and I'm sure I'll work them out by searching, are how the "T pieces" work when you're trying to get both the oil pressure sensor and the low pressure to fit. Can I keep the power steering? What drive shafts? Will a 205 radiator be sufficient to cool a 6 engine?

 

I'll get there in the end!

 

Cheers!

[gti-si 0]

1. Yes you can keep power steering, use a Rallye aux belt set up.

2. Depends what hubs your using. 1.6/1.9 will be fine. I would go for 1.9 myself, even if it meant swapping hubs.

3. Radiator is more than sufficient.

 

The t-piece is what it says really. The gti6 don't come with s pressure sensor, just a switch (for the STOP light). You remove the pressure switch and screw in the t-piece. Then you screw into the t-piece, the original 8v pressure sesnor and the pressure switch, enabling you to have a pressure reading.

[Gman 29]

Thanks for that.

 

If using the 1.9 shafts, would I need to use the 306 hubs then? They come in either 16mm or 18mm iirc.

 

I will look up the rallye set up as it sounds confusing! All very daunting stuff this but I have time on my side!

[gti-si 0]

No the 205 1.9 shafts = 205 1.9 hubs. Not 306 shafts. The Rallye is the light more sporting version of the gti6. It doesn't come with AC, so the only items on the AUX belt are the alternator and the PAS. It's easier than running without it as you don't have to mess around fabricating a tensioner for the alternator on it's own

Edited August 14, 2009 by gti-si

[Gman 29]

No the 205 1.9 shafts = 205 1.9 hubs. Not 306 shafts. The Rallye is the light more sporting version of the gti6. It doesn't come with AC, so the only items on the AUX belt are the alternator and the PAS. It's easier than running without it as you don't have to mess around fabricating a tensioner for the alternator on it's own

 

Sorry, I thought you were talking about the 205 rallye- that makes sense now!

 

I will sort out a proper thread in due course but if I go for the shorter rallye belt, do I use the 205 or 306 alternator?

 

Thanks again!

[gti-si 0]

306 alternator and then the belt + tensioner from the 306 Rallye. Think the s16 uses the same set up too, but probably a little harder to get hold of

[Gman 29]

Thanks again. I'll stop posting now and get round to sorting out a project thread as I just received a lovely message telling me to stop trolling.

 

Not the welcome I was expecting but hey ho.

 

Cheers. Graham

[large 33]

Not all GTi6 has AC so you could use a belt set up from one of them.

[welshpug 1,661]

or any XU10J4R that hasn't got a/c.

 

S16/2.0 Mi16 uses a different tensioner setup, nothing like the J4R/RS one.

[andyjstone 6]

not really sure if there is a 'guide' as such but the six engine is pretty much the same and any other xu engine in that it mounts the same.

there are a few problems that come with a bigger engine (brake servo/exhaust manifold clearance etc.)

 

Actually I think we could do with more step by step guides about how to do various conversions - if you have done it you know what fits on what, but if you haven't it's a nightmare.

 

I'm running a '6' with the original 1.6 gearbox and 1.6 hubs at the moment, but I'm in the process of changing the hubs to 1.9s and changing the brake calipers to GTI6 units. It took me loads of questions on here and emails to Miles (thanks as always!) to work out exactly what bits I need and not only that, but what is the best make to buy as it seems that some are crap - or at least that's what I've been told.

 

So, don't know whose going to write it, but you can see the OP is struggling here and I can see why, we need a step by step guide to do most of the common upgrades (and I can't see there are that many), what goes with what and what parts to use and ideally where to get them.

 

Which leads me on to another point, everyone on here keeps recommending various makes/models of parts, but they aren't always easy to get. Surely someone on here could set up and ebay shop or something and be able to supply all the parts we need - I for one wouldn't mind paying a little more just to have somewhere I could get the right parts.

 

Cor, I feel better after getting that off my chest!

[rubyna 4 1 Cars]

Actually I think we could do with more step by step guides about how to do various conversions - if you have done it you know what fits on what, but if you haven't it's a nightmare.

 

I'm running a '6' with the original 1.6 gearbox and 1.6 hubs at the moment, but I'm in the process of changing the hubs to 1.9s and changing the brake calipers to GTI6 units. It took me loads of questions on here and emails to Miles (thanks as always!) to work out exactly what bits I need and not only that, but what is the best make to buy as it seems that some are crap - or at least that's what I've been told.

 

So, don't know whose going to write it, but you can see the OP is struggling here and I can see why, we need a step by step guide to do most of the common upgrades (and I can't see there are that many), what goes with what and what parts to use and ideally where to get them.

 

Which leads me on to another point, everyone on here keeps recommending various makes/models of parts, but they aren't always easy to get. Surely someone on here could set up and ebay shop or something and be able to supply all the parts we need - I for one wouldn't mind paying a little more just to have somewhere I could get the right parts.

 

Cor, I feel better after getting that off my chest!

 

I know what your saying but theres plenty of people willing to help, like has allready been said start a project thread and when he comes to a problem or needs a pointer there will be plenty of replies from people.. And as for the parts point, Miles sells most parts needed and we have a parts for sale section which i think is ample, if you wanted you could build a car from the ground up with the parts for sale on here plus a few wanted adds!!!

[andyjstone 6]

I know what your saying but theres plenty of people willing to help, like has allready been said start a project thread and when he comes to a problem or needs a pointer there will be plenty of replies from people.. And as for the parts point, Miles sells most parts needed and we have a parts for sale section which i think is ample, if you wanted you could build a car from the ground up with the parts for sale on here plus a few wanted adds!!!

 

Nope, sorry, I disagree. You can buy plenty of parts on here, but most are second hand. Not a problem, but then if you want to refurb them what parts do you need, what's the best make and where do you get them from.

 

As I said in my original post I'm in the proces of upgrading and refurbing my front end. I bought some 2nd hand 1.9 hubs and GTI6 brake calipers on here, but I wanted new bearings for the hubs and I'm still not sure I've got the right ones. Still want to replace the wishbones while I'm at it, but not found anywhere to get the ones that I've been told on here I want.

 

I've spent ages already trawling this forum and talking/emailing people I know and still don't have all the answers for a very simple (maybe not!) upgrade. I don't really have time to do all this, all I really want is for someone to tell me what I need, where I can get it and then do the work!

[pugpete1108 62 1 Cars]

Nope, sorry, I disagree. You can buy plenty of parts on here, but most are second hand. Not a problem, but then if you want to refurb them what parts do you need, what's the best make and where do you get them from.

 

As I said in my original post I'm in the proces of upgrading and refurbing my front end. I bought some 2nd hand 1.9 hubs and GTI6 brake calipers on here, but I wanted new bearings for the hubs and I'm still not sure I've got the right ones. Still want to replace the wishbones while I'm at it, but not found anywhere to get the ones that I've been told on here I want.

 

I've spent ages already trawling this forum and talking/emailing people I know and still don't have all the answers for a very simple (maybe not!) upgrade. I don't really have time to do all this, all I really want is for someone to tell me what I need, where I can get it and then do the work!

 

advice is all well and good and finding out how one person has done it is ok,but as they say there's 'more than one way to skin a cat'

 

finding out how to do something imo is half the fun, thats half the reason i opted for something than was six months ago way over my head (most of it still is ) running megasquirt managment when something like emerald was a much simpler (if more expesive) option.

 

buying new parts is not always an option given the stealer prices, so second hand diy refurbs are a great idea

 

and in answer to your problem surely if you have gti6 callipers then get gti6 bearings? and arn't all wishbones the same? be it 205/309 items or rose jointed if your pockets are deep enough.

 

you need 1.9 shafts,1.9 hubs 306 callipers and 205/309 wishbones?

pete

[andyjstone 6]

and in answer to your problem surely if you have gti6 callipers then get gti6 bearings? and arn't all wishbones the same? be it 205/309 items or rose jointed if your pockets are deep enough.

 

you need 1.9 shafts,1.9 hubs 306 callipers and 205/309 wishbones?

pete

 

Yes, but you're totally missing my point! Like you I enjoy finding out about these things and doing the work, but what you have said above is an exact example of what I'm talking about - you appear to know what you are talking about, but your answer does't necessarily make sense.

 

I have got 205 1.9 hubs, so presumably I want 205 1.9 bearings, not GTI6 bearings, or am I missing something?

 

You ask the question 'aren't all wishbones the same? How do I know, why are you asking me? I just need to know the answer and where to get them! I've been told to get Pug ones, but no-one seems to be able to supply them! So, I have nice new GKN drive shafts that I've been told I should get, 1.9 hubs that I have stripped and painted, but failed to get the SKF bearings I've been told I should get. Got GTI6 calipers which I've cleaned up and painted, got some nice shiny new GTI6 discs. Bit I ain't got no wishbones - again the bearings in the existing ones are shot and I was told I need complete new units, but surely I can get new bearings or can't I and if I can where do I get them......it goes on......

[pugpete1108 62 1 Cars]

s*it sorry by bad i meant 1.9 hubs so 1.9 bearings

 

i know its difficult trying to match things up especially when you are unsure where the second hand units have come from or what car exactly.and given some motor factors are cr*p and dont know their arshole from their elbow it can be real tricky,i'm lucky as my local place (lcp) are very good and they help me no end with getting the right part.

 

if it was me (and i'm tight) i would source some 205 gti wishbones (secondhand if the ball joints are good) and replace the rubber bushes (either poly ones or std depending on budget, i polyed mine)

 

get a set of 1.9 gti front bearings (can be a pain to remove/fit but not impossible) again it depends on budget, i brought unknown bearings 3 yrs ago and have had no trouble with them. ( i dont exactly know if the 1.9 units are different from the 1.6's in regards to replacable bearings? i assume so?)

 

it all really depends on budget and how hard you drive your car or even how long you intend to own it, cheaper/pattern items should last as long as genuine items in my experience that is.

 

it didn't mean to sound patronising in any way

 

try these bearings (check with seller to see they fit first just for gaurentee)

ebay

or these wishbones?

ebay

failing that i can try my local and get you a price and fitment?

Edited August 14, 2009 by pugpete1108

[andyjstone 6]

it didn't mean to sound patronising in any way

 

You didn't, the point I was really making in this topic wasn't about my own issues, it was more a general one that it would be much easier if someone was to put together all the info in one place.

 

As far as my wishbones go I am in the fortunate position where budget isn't an issue, it's more a question of doing it right and not having to do it again

[pugpete1108 62 1 Cars]

You didn't, the point I was really making in this topic wasn't about my own issues, it was more a general one that it would be much easier if someone was to put together all the info in one place.

 

As far as my wishbones go I am in the fortunate position where budget isn't an issue, it's more a question of doing it right and not having to do it again

 

yeah it did get a bit off topic didn't it?

 

a rough guide of what is basically needed is a good idea imo too but if he gets a thread started that will help him alot.

 

the only problem with a written guide is that people will take it as gospel, and one persons opinion is not nescessarily anothers as i'm sure you have found out already

 

anyway good luck with the wishbone issue if money is not a problem go for the best you can get- even if they are custom jobbies

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

It's on my to do list, I;ve found a supplier of Motaquip Wishbones, shame it's not that close, Bearings etc will be online soon too, Only thing I cannot do is GKN shafts even GSF are having problems now as they have shut the UK supplier

[welshpug 1,661]

having said that, the boot kits GSF have on the shelf are GKN instead of corrteco in a few cases i;ve seen recently.

[andyjstone 6]

It's on my to do list, I;ve found a supplier of Motaquip Wishbones, shame it's not that close, Bearings etc will be online soon too, Only thing I cannot do is GKN shafts even GSF are having problems now as they have shut the UK supplier

 

If you are getting wishbones please get me a set as I'm having trouble locating them.

 

I managed to get a pair of GKN drive shafts from East Kent Components - recommended by GKN and they had them on the shelf.