2 Row Vs 3 Row Mi16 Ecu's

[KRISKARRERA 2 1 Cars]

My Haynes engine management manual reckons the timing will be advanced until knock is detected and then retarded a little, and does this many times a second. So in theory stick in higher octane fuel and you gain power. Or am I wrong?

 

My Parkers price guide from 1992 shows the cat version of the 1.9 Mi16 being available in UK from 1991, maybe just it didn't sell because the more powerful D6C was still available and able to run fine on unleaded.

 

Autocar magazine tested both the 2 row 405 Mi16 in '88 and then the 3 row 405 Mi16 in '91. The latter was slower and all they could think was that it was being run on 95 unleaded instead of the 98 4 star of the 2 row. Plus the '91 car had the 195/55/15s which is a very slightly larger rolling radius than the 195/60/14s of the '88 car. Probably was just a Friday afternoon car though.

[d-9 0]

Presence of a knock sensor and a lambda mean that the settings for fuelling and ignition are at their optimum working tolerances, It being a closed loop system meaning it can always adjust fuelling and ign to suit engine load and rpm... Whereas dizzy/rotor arm- non lambda and knock sensor systems are open loop- meaning their settings for rpm etc are set values...... maybe I'm just reiterating other peoples points... but I wanted to be included!!!!

 

Remember that normal (narrowband) lambda sensors only work at idle.

[BackStreetRacecars 3]

Remember that normal (narrowband) lambda sensors only work at idle.

 

 

had thought about mentioning some wiiide band action but... hey all good...

[Dutch205er 0]

I am currently building an DFW engine into my Pug, which should be running on a 3 row ECU, but i got an 2 row 119 ECU and loom.

So no cat and no knocksensor if i am correct.

 

Will this combination work OK, or what are (dis)advantages ?

[Henry 1.9GTi 36]

The Mi has the map loaded into the ecu and is a preset ignition advance curve. That, as said will be retarded incrementally until knock is no longer detected then stepped back up to the set ignition advance for that particular speed / load.

 

It won’t increase the ignition advance until knock is detected and run on a negative feedback loop, it only steps it back up to the preset ignition curve if it has been previously reduced due to knock being sensed.

 

So with engine mods and no worry about tractability, emissions, NVH etc... The ignition curve is far from perfect.

[DrSarty 90 1 Cars]

NVH

?

 

What's that please Hen or am I being dumb?

 

From PeterT's back-to-back tests, he did conclude that the map on the 3-row was more difficult to improve upon.

 

I suppose it's arguable that the knock sensor on the 3-row helps the engine stay closer to these better load site settings than the perhaps poorer ones on the 2-row map. All of it could therefore mean more tractability which could be seen to be better performance.

 

Just a random thought.

Edited April 26, 2010 by DrSarty

[Cloverleaf 1]

The 2 row ecu also batch fires all injectors at once. The 3 row fires in pairs.

[DrSarty 90 1 Cars]

The 2 row ecu also batch fires all injectors at once. The 3 row fires in pairs.

 

Negligable differences perhaps?

 

[jackherer 543]

NVH = Noise, Vibration & Harshness, its an auto industry term that basically rates just how dull a modern car is...

[DrSarty 90 1 Cars]

 

Political mechanical correctness madness.

 

Vibration's where it's at...apparently.

[Dutch205er 0]

The Mi has the map loaded into the ecu and is a preset ignition advance curve. That, as said will be retarded incrementally until knock is no longer detected then stepped back up to the set ignition advance for that particular speed / load.

 

It won’t increase the ignition advance until knock is detected and run on a negative feedback loop, it only steps it back up to the preset ignition curve if it has been previously reduced due to knock being sensed.

 

So with engine mods and no worry about tractability, emissions, NVH etc... The ignition curve is far from perfect.

 

 

Thanks, i also know the DFW engine has thinner pistonheads and shape which results in lower compression.

Is it wise to drive this combination ECU/loom DFW or should i better get another ECU/loom with knocksensor ?

This engine should run for a feww years

[Dutch205er 0]

?

 

What's that please Hen or am I being dumb?

 

From PeterT's back-to-back tests, he did conclude that the map on the 3-row was more difficult to improve upon.

 

I suppose it's arguable that the knock sensor on the 3-row helps the engine stay closer to these better load site settings than the perhaps poorer ones on the 2-row map. All of it could therefore mean more tractability which could be seen to be better performance.

 

Just a random thought.

 

So it depends on the perdrfined map in the ECU, and the map can be altered ?